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Old 03-02-2010, 06:55 AM
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Let me start off by saying this is a very long post. If you don't have the time or are not interested in alot of information, please do not continue reading this thread. My situation is not your average case. I included alot of things in here so anyone reading it or following the thread might be able to help me or recognize things that I am missing.

I will be using this to document my road to recovery. I am confident that I will reach my health goals sometime in the near future and would like your help to achieve them. For the past 11 months, I have taken a very aggressive approach to get healthy again, but I am not there yet. I will try to provide some good background information on everything relating to my health and treatment so you have a general idea of what is going on. I have seen many traditonal doctors locally and at various leading health facilities in my state and they are stumped. I have worked with a few holistic/integrative type doctors and made some progress, but my health still continues to get worse. In regards to doctors and my treatment, I am going to be seeing mostly holistic/functional medicine type doctors, doing research/learning on my own, and asking for help/guidance on various forums to regain my health again.

In addition, my philosophy and take on my whole health situation, is that I refuse to believe that I will not get healthy again. It seems like a lifetime ago, but I was once in a position of optimal health and life was almost perfect. With all the advances in modern medicine and good people out there willing to help, I know that will regain my heath.

Background: Around 14-15 started using supplements to build muscle and help with football. I remember taking dhea, tribulus territis, andro, creatinine, protein, etc. Body was in great shape. Around the same time, I also started marijuana/alcohol use. About 18, from drugs and lack of always working out, body and libido took a little hit, but still appeared on the outside to be doing well. Late 18, played college football and blew up too about 250+, which was very high for me. Alot of substance abuse. At 19, I used 1 bottle of the steroid deca along with some dbol. Body was looking good, libido dropped a little. Late 19, started to do alot of cocaine. About 20, started to lose alot of weight and quality of life took a hit. Felt very bad, but couldn't really tell because of so much alcohol and drugs. Still worked out though, throughout this whole time so I never just let myself completely go. 21-22, alot of substance abuse and life just spiraling downhill.

About 23, finally sobered myself up and got my stuff together. Once off the cocaine however, I started to gain some serious weight. Went from about 225 to 300 pounds in less than 2 years. At 24, even though I was gaining alot of weight and health was in bad shape, I was happy that I would be a college graduate. After this, I really started to evaluate my health situation, like wtf is going on. At late 24, went to go see a Doc about the weight gain and possible thryoid issues, and tsh came out a 5.1. So I thought I was on to something. However, I retested a couple months later and it was in range. This had myself and my family stumped so we did not do anything for awhile. And about a year ago. I finally decided I could not take it anymore. The weight gain, lack of libido, constant hunger, no energy, etc. was just something that I just had to address. So I started researching online and came across this forum, among others. I figured that I probably had a low T issue going on, found a local doc, and low and behold, my T is at the level of a 100 year old man. I also found out that I had a very low cholesterol levels.

I tried taking some cream for the T thinking that would solve my problems and life would be good again, however I had a terrible reaction to the T, which was that it made feel like I was going to have a heart attack. Not a little pain here or there, constant pressure and pain in the chest area and shortness of breath, etc. Next step was to go see an endo. He tried shots to see if that would work, but I had the same reaction. However he did find out that I was anemic. I was then referred to a GI and blood doc to look for possible causes of anemia. Had alot of testing and scans to look for things and the GI doc found out the I had an inflamed esphagus and this might be causing the anemia, but he really didn't think so. So at that point, nobody had any solutions for me so I researched why I could have reacted that way to the T. I thought it could possibly be due to thryoid/adrenal problem so I looked for a doctor that might be able to help. Due to my heath continuing to get worse and rush to judgment, I actually flew to see a doctor that I thought had all the answers. After a saliva test said low cortisol, I proceeded with the adrenal medidation cortef. The cortef did raise my T a little, but I felt absolutely awful. Very jittery and nervous and just plain sick.

Then I was asked to increased the dose of cortef I was on and that's when things took a turn for the worst. I started to get intense headaches, which eventually turned into alot of pain in head, neck, and spine, and that eventually turned into the pain in the CNS plus numbness and tingling in the arms. I went off the cortef, but it was too late. The symptoms continued to progress. So I went to various leading institiions such as the Cleveland Clinic and others to make sure that I was not dying or had some terrible disease and so far, things are looking ok in those regards. Thank god.

Up until a few weeks ago, I was still having the CNS symptoms until I noticed something while visiting a family member. I ended up drinking alot of ice water throughout the day and for some reason, it was helping the symptoms I was having. So I decided to keep drinking ice water every day after that and it started to really help. I still felt like crap overall, but at least the pain my CNS and numbness in limbs had became a little more bearable. Then I had a two boils checked out on my lower abdomen that was causing me some problems. Doc did a swab, sent it away and put me on doxycycline in the meantime. I went to Cleveland Clinic for an endoscopy and capsule endoscopy, and on the way home I got the results from the infection which came back as Klebsiella Pneumoniae. So the doc switched me to Keflex and all my CNS symptoms came back again within a day or two.

As you can imagine, I was very disappointed. I tried to switch the antibiotic to Bactrim DS to see if that might help, but the damage was already done. I currently still drink alot of ice water throughout the day, but it no longer helps. And that is where I am at. I am waiting for test results from a spectracell test, Genova stool sample, Genova toxic element hair test, capsule endoscopy test, and testing for a few common viruses.

Relevant Lab tests: I have a very low cholesterol level from my understanding. The total is 99 and the good one is about 20. Triglycerides were mildly elevated 8 months ago, but are now in range. The low cholesterol issue is not genetic and does not make sense for someone who is 6'0, 300 pounds and eats like a horse. And alot of food with cholesterol in it.

Anemia. Virtually all measurement related to red blood cells are low on my CBC. Hemoglobin, mcv, etc. Rdw is always high. Iron levels on TIBC are pretty low. Iron is about 50/60, transferrin is always in range, and the iron saturation is always low at about 17%. I have an elevated reticulocyte count, which means that my red blood cells are getting destroyed to fast. Ferritin is in ok range at a little under a 100. Erythropoetin level is elevated.

Thyroid/Adrenals: Tsh usually over 3, with the lowest being 2.7 All other thyroid levels are in range I believe. Could be on the high end of range or low end. Cortisol used to be around 13, but was at 16/17 last time I checked. Still take a 2.5 mg of cortef every once in a while because I feel shaky if I go too many days/weeks without it.

Testosterone: Around 200. Lowest being 150 and highest about 290.

Vitamins/minerals: Did a genova Nutre-eval test which showed multiple defieiences and problems with detoxification, methylation, etc. Mercury level was high on Genova test, but in normal range on Quest lab test. Waiting for hair toxic element test to come back as well as spectracell test.

Important things to mention: I have a history of infections. I used to get alot ear infections as a kid, lots of antibiotics. Had a pinworm infection when I young as well. Got what I think was a staph infection in jail at 19 years old, thumb ended up swelling up terrible for a long time. A few years later, developed a pilonidal cyst infection that ended up going on for almost a year or two. As I started to gain weight, developed boils in various places on body such as armpit, inner thigh, lower abdomen. Boils on lower abs just abcessed recently and the bacteria found was klebsiella pnuemonia, which from my understanding healthy people are not supposed to get and is a good sign that my immune system is very weak.

Also, I took alot of anti-acid medication when I started to gain weight to try and control heartburn. I took the otc med called zantac in excess for a couple years. Like 15-20 pills a day because I thought it made me feel better than taking a PPI. Still took some PPI's like nexium to if it would help, but made my health worse. I think this really messed the balance in my stomach.

And when I tried to reintroduce the cortef after going off it for the first time, I only went to about 5mg to 7.5mg a day, but my symptoms got much worse. My right eye started twitching a lot, left arm started getting more numb. That is when I reduced the cortef dose to the very bare minimum I would need such as 2.5 mg every week or so.

I also might have an issue with possible elevated levels of mercury. I got a fairly large tattoo when I was about 18 that used a good amount of red ink in it, among other colors. I also have eaten an enormous amount of canned tuna and fish over the years. Partly because it was good for muscle building, etc. Started eating at least a can day when I was about 14 and went off and on for a little while, but it has always been a staple in my diet.

Lastly, I think that my body is very sensitive to things like medication, etc. The way my body reacted to the T cream and shots and the cortef, probably indicates something. Maybe my immune system is very sensitive or some other body system is very sensitive. Not sure what it is, but its important to point out.

My biggest symptoms: The number one issue going on for me is an uncontrollable appetite and constant hunger. I actually feel hungrier right after I eat sometimes. I noticed a few food allergies starting to develop several months ago, so I have cut out various foods, but it still did not make a difference. I have eat every few hours or I almost feel sick and cannot function very well. This has been going for a number of years and slowly gets worse every day. It feels like I am not absorbing any of the food I am eating. I am currently looking for the underlying cause of this issue and will really need your help figuring it out. I am hoping the test results I am waiting on will show something in these regards.

In a sense, I am virtually eating myself to death. I do workout a few times a week and eat healthy food, and this keeps me somewhat in balance, but my health progressively gets worse. I very rarely enjoy eating a meal and it is essentially just a constant hassel to eat all the time. Very mentally draining, especially when your health deteriorates by the day.

The second thing is finding out what is causing the pain in my head, neck, and spine and numbness in the arms. I thought at first it might be MS or something similar, but it is not. I had all the tests. I think it is somehow related to my gastrointestinal system, toxins, poor blood circulation, or vitamin/mineral defieciency. I think the fact that all these symptoms came back after taking one of the worst antibiotics for disrupting your gut flora, Keflex, is a very good sign that the stomach and my CNS symptoms might be connected. And from I read about water, it can dilute toxins in your body, and that is probably why I felt better drinking alot of it.

Next is a frequent urination issue. I have been going to the bathroom almost 20-40 times a day for the last few years. At least 5-10 times at night sometimes. I have however also consumed a good amount of water throughout the day, so endo's ruled d insipudus. The urination all the time is a terrible burden on my life. Can't really ever relax and always looking for a bathroom somewhere you go. And I was checked out by a urologist who did various tests checking for a problem, like restriction or bladder spazm and everything is fine. I think it has do with me probably having low T for so long I am losing sensation or something. I remember reading something I think Dr. Shippen wrote about when he said that alot of testosterone receptors are located in mens genital area and when he has low T, it is very common that he also has frequent urination as well.

Also, weight gain and weight is an issue for me. I am 6'0, 300 pounds and am overweight. It has profound effect on my health. Ever since the CNS symptoms started to happen, I cut out lifting and stuck with running. I could barely run well before this because of so much pain in my ankles, feet, knees, etc. I actually cannot even do sprints any more or jog that well because of plantar fascilitis. I do still push through it though and can barely walk normal for a day or two after working out, just because I have to keep exercising.

Lastly, is my T and energy level. Both are very poor. I am however focused on the other areas of my health first, because I think as I start losing weight, my T will go up and I will have more energy.

What I am suspecting: I think there is some serious issues going on in my gastronintestinal system and or with detoxification of toxins. I have to figure out the underlying cause of why I am so hungry all the time and cannot lose any weight or put on any muscle. I am not sure if it is an issue with my intestines maybe very damaged and they are not absorbing nutrients properly. Could possibly be an enzyme defeiceiny because my bile flow is somehow blocked or bile isn't being utilized properly. Maybe some kind of infection with candida/parasites/bacteria, that is robbing me of all of the imporant vitamins and minerals and signaling to my body to keep eating. Not sure here but this is my #1 focus as of now. I have completed a one stool test so far that showed I could possibly having a problem with candida. I waiting results of another stool this week that will show alot more information.

I am not sure what is going on with detoxification and its pathways, but I think mine could be very messed up right now. From understanding, alot of times people who are struggling with weight gain have alot of fat soluble toxins being stored in their body fat. And the process of the liver being overworked all the time just keeps fueling this process. I am interested in doing some testing to see what is going on here and possibly some trial and error with medications to see if something can work. However, I think the stomach has been addressed first, then come detoxification from what I have read. But in my case, they might be connected, not sure yet.

I have to figure out what is causing my low cholesterol levels. I feel this issue is directly connected to what is causing some of the underlying problems in my case. It could be connected with the bile and liver somehow. Or maybe the indirect result of me not absorbing food properly. I am not sure where it fits in, but know that its important.

I have to figure out what is causing the anemia and issues with RBC's. I also feel that this is connected to some of the underlying problems in my case. What I am having a hard time trying to figure out is why its happening. I am not sure if the iron and RBC's are getting used up from something in my gi tract. Maybe some kind of internal bleeding. Or possibly the levels are low because my body is trying protect itself by hiding the iron from an infection or pathogenic organism. Maybe a toxin like mercury is causing the anemia, but seems unlikely.

In regards to the pain I am experiencing in my head, neck, and spine and the numbness in my arms sometimes, I have at least ruled out a few things. At that is I don't have MS or any other neurological disease, and any other major illness that traditional doctors can find. I am suspecting a possible poor circulation of blood flow because my hands and feet get cold sometimes. And the anemia could be contributing the blood flow issue as well. Or possibly one vitamin/mineral deficiency or multiple ones. Or maybe some kind of toxin, such as toxins from candida/parasite/bacteria, or possibly an environmental or heavy metal like mercury.

Right now I am waiting on a few test results and looking for ways to control my appetite. I looked into possibly juicing fruits and vegetables to help with weight loss and detoxification while I am trying to figure out the underlying causes of my problems, and it seems like a very viable option. I am also looking for doctors that know about some of the issues I am suspecting and will be trying to schedule appointments with them in the near future.

The only thing I am a little worried about now trying to put these pieces together. After the T didn't work for me and the adrenal/thyroid medication didn't work, this an area where not too many people know what to do. There are some people such as functional medicine doctors and other integrative doctors that probably would be able to help and that is who I will be working with. The point is that cannot give up or will not give up. I know my situation is a difficult one, but I have learned alot and continue to learn and will not stop until I can regain somewhat of a normal life. As mentioned earlier, with all the good peope out there willing to help and advances in modern medicine, there has got to be some way to improve the quality of my life.

If you can think of anything that might help me in any way or have any questions, please respond to the thread. I will post test results and progress as they develop.

This might sound like alot to try an fix and recover from, but I will do it. I have overcame so many obstacles in my life. This will just end up being one more and it will make me a stronger person in the end. Thank you reading this post.
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Old 03-02-2010, 08:40 AM
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Greetings Pete,

I did read your whole post. I will say that it is a complex issue and probably too complex for any of us to figure out in totality. But you will likely get suggestions to look into from different folks.

The first thing that came to mind is to see a chiropractor for the numbness issues and headaches. I have had exactly the same issues and chiropractic resolved them. After my second child I had so much numbness and weakness in my arms that I could not keep them up on the steerig wheel in the car. Headaches all the time. Things can come out of alignment at times for some people without an injury. But you could be paying past dues for football.

To me you have a pathogen overload. I suspect that the infections you have had have never been cured. Hence the repeated issues. We talk a lot about parasite issues here. A parasite is anything living in your body that does not belong there. It may be one celled or multicelled. They can logde in organs, glands and run in the blood. One parasite will lead to another. Parasites cause an acidic conditon in the body which favors the presence of other parasites.

Cholesterol is the basis for the formation of hormones. If your liver is not up to par and not enough cholesterol is produced you can suffer hormonally. Parasites and latent infection can debilitate the liver.

I suspect that you have an iodine deficiency. Most Americans do. There are many posts here on iodine supplementation and you will find them though a forum search. Iodine will affect your thyroid function. Most doctors accept too low a level of thyroid function for the naturopaths preferences. Iodine is also a mediator of parasites. It will not cure all parasitic conditions but it helps to create an environment where they don't want to be around. Mega Iodine supplementation can cure some infections. The prostate has a great affinity for iodine. If there isn't enough around the gland will deteriorate along with the thyroid.

You need a parasite cleanse. Personally I have found MMS to be the single most powerful parasite cleanser ever.... but there are other ways.
to learn about MMS1 and MMS2 go to www.jimhumble.biz and read everything there.

If for some reason you do not want to do MMS you can look into Hulda Clarks parasite cleanses. She has one for the liver, the kidneys and the intestines. Personally if I were in your shoes I would do the Clark protocols because they will help to open the oragans of elimination and get things moving. They will kill a lot of parasites but when that is done I would still follow up with MMS for the final parasite kill. I say this because you mentioned that you thought your organs of elimination may be having problems.
https://www.drclark.net/en/cleanses_clean-ups/parasite_cleanses.php
even if you don't have stones the cleanse should be done. Several may be required.
It will facilitate dumping of lots of toxins and parasties, chemicals, etc.
https://www.healthsalon.org/385/the-liver-flush/

I would find a world class Naturopath and do everything they say. I know an excellent on in Pocatello Idaho named Dr West. djt knows one in the state of Washington. You may need to be prepared to stay by them for a few weeks. I'm sure there are others aroud and perhaps someone else will have a good idea. I am not sure what Dr West does in regard to allergy but the one djt knows is expert in allergy and it sounds like you have those issues. Basically, anyone in your shape will have those type of issues. It will take detox and immune system modulation to get past them. If you go to djt's site you will find her discussing then naturopaths that do this work https://truthquest2.com/drOGCarroll.htm
I'm not sure Dr Carroll is around anymore but djt (Diane) knows others from the same lineage. Contact her.

At this point I would suggest that you be on a Mediterranean diet. No sugar, no soft drinks, no white bread, no chemical additatives. Use high quality oils like olive and grapeseed oil. Use the grapeseed oil for sauteeing not the olive, olive burns too easily. Most of the food you eat should be raw including oil and nuts. Lots of salads with fresh and if possible organic veggies. Your grains should be organic brown rice an quiona, but in moderation. No pasta. Lots of fresh or frozen berries. Jarrow whey is an excellent protien supplement and will assist in getting the glutathione pathways going. A naturopath might possibly give you IV's of this stuff along with other nutrients.

I suspect that your digestive issues are related to a lack of hydrochloric acid in the gut. You have managed to turn off most of your systems, why not the stomach too?
Even though you have exteme reflux your acid can be too low and this in fact will increase relfux symptoms. It only takes a little acid to really burn bad and if reflux is continual it will burn bad continually. If there is not enough acid fermentaion and bloating start in the stomach and cause the reflux. Betain hydrochloric acid should be taken with all meals. Start with two or three pills. you need to take enough so that there is a warm sensation in your stomach. Only take them just minutes before eating a meal with every meal. Larger meals may require more pills. Also, you should start digestive enzymes with meals. These two things will facilitate better digestion and you may feel less hungry.

I wonder if you have been checked for hypoglycemia. That is often a precursor to diabetes and may cause headaches and feelings of weakness and hunger. If you have it the mediterrean diet will help quite a bit.

I would suggest that you get your pituitary gland checked. Just make sure it is Ok. It is the master gland and regulates others. Although not common difficulities there should be ruled out before focusing on other glands. Becasue your TSH was high at one time it makes me wonder, and checking will do no harm

Drinking water is fine but do not drink with meals water or any other liquid and I strongly suggest that you drink alkaline water. You surely have ph problems. You can purchase a machine that makes your water alkaline.
I would not go so far to say to supplement with baking soda, sodium bicarb at this point but it many not be ruled out eventually. Sodium bicarb although a great ph mediator will cause further difficulties with your digestion and since you are eating all the time when would be the right time to take it? I suggest that you start to learn about ph. There is a book called the PH miracle by Dr Robert Day. Dr Day has also been a great promoter of the precursor product to MMS called stabilized oxygen. It does what mms does but mms is much faster and more powerful. Get the book. Also go to this website and start reading by Dr Sircus: https://imva.info/ you will start to learn about mercury toxicity here. You can get rid of it.


Look into supplementing with vitamin D3 and vitamin C, plain ascorbic acid and a B100 tablet. Its the basics aside from iodine. You want to keep yourself from getting cancer. We have lots of info here if you do a forum search.

I hope this is helpful to you
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Last edited by Arrowwind09; 03-03-2010 at 02:02 PM.
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Old 03-03-2010, 05:13 AM
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Hi Pete, welcome to our forum.
The one thing that stands out to me is your weight and having to urinate so
frequently as well as constantly feeling hungry. Have you been tested for
Diabetes or pre-diabetes? Diabetes can adversely effect your vision, your limbs,
energy and overall how you feel.

Eating frequently is not too bad depending on how much you eat and what
you eat at any one time? I agree with Arrow about what she tells you to cut
out - sugars, etc. Small amounts only; teaspoons not tablespoons!
If Diabetic you need to be very careful what type of carbs you eat. Potatoes
are a no-no, as are pastas, any white flour products, etc.
Beginning a meal with 1/2 a grapefruit may help a bit with weight, as well as
giving you natural Vit C. It also can cut your appetite back a bit.
Taking antibiotics can tear up some people's digestive systems. A friend of mine
gets diahreah every time she has to use an antibiotic.
I do wish you much good luck with getting your health back; you seem to have
great spirit and fortitude in your quest.
BTW, how old are you now?
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Last edited by EarlyBird; 03-03-2010 at 05:26 AM. Reason: Forgot something!
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Old 03-03-2010, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arrowwind09 View Post
Greetings Pete,

I did read your whole post. I will say that it is a complex issue and probably too complex for any of us to figure out in totality. But you will likely get suggestions to look into from different folks.
...

I agree about the pathogen overload. Not sure if it is one thing or maybe multiple things, but with all the infections I had and lab results and symptoms going on, it usually signals this. Concerning parasites, I am hoping the Genova stool test might show something. Another person I was speaking with looked at my overall situation and thought it might be some kind of protozoa. I know that with worm parasites, alot of times your eosophils count on your blood cells is elevated and my in normal I think. Still could be something though, maybe hookworm because of anemia.

In regards to cholesterol, I am trying to figure out where that fits into my situation. With actually every going on, I am just trying to see where each thing fits and could make the most sense. For example, how would low cholesterol be tied with increased hunger and appetite. Or anemia be connected to my symptoms. Basically just looking at my entire history, what I have going on with my labs and symptoms, and try to figure out what makes the most sense why I could experiencing what I am going through and then try to fix it. Sounds easier that it looks, lol.

But the cholesterol issue is puzzling. I was looking into maybe I have alot of gallstones or liver stones and that could be causing problems. And have thought about a liver flush. I might do all the flushes you recommended. Also my doc mentioned using the Heel Detox Kit to help.

About the liver flush, I noticed alot of them say to drink apple juice. I can drink the juice fine and eat cooked apples, but there is another problem I didn't mention. And that is if I eat an apple, I feel very sick and just overall feel awful. Not sure why this is. I read that apples can expel toxins I think. It just seems interesting of the connecting between apple or apple juice and softening gallstones. However, I also feel pretty bad if an eat banana. Not the same as an apple, but feel a little sick. And those are the only two things that cause me problems.

And other people have mentioned that an infection inside my body or gi tract could deplete cholesterol. Maybe it could have something to do with mercury. Or it could have something do to with my not absorbing nutrients because stomach lining is messed up.

Here is a link to liver flush protocol. Does it look ok?
https://www.worldwidehealthcenter.net/articles-25.html

I am going to ask my doctor this week to do a detoxification profile using challenging substances like aspirin, caffeine, etc. Maybe this would shine some light on the situation. Do you think this would be a good test for me?

I live in Florida and do not have the money right now to be able to fly and see a Doc. I am working with an ok doc in florida right now that is on the holistic side and is good with chelation if I need it. I think my best bet is to find a doc that practices functional medicine. And I have searched for some and they are a few that I can drive to.

I don't think I can take the betaine hcl because I have an ulcer. Also lots of current heartburn and a hiatal hernia. Ulcer came back negative for h pylori as did biopises of my intestine. Maybe stool sample might show h pylori.

I think I did have an issue with hypoglycemia before and have cut alot of sugary food since.

I had pituatary checked and have a small adenoma, 3mm, but it is non functioning.

I will look into the iodine and vitamins you mentioned.

My biggest thing is that I need to have plan and need to hopefully be addressing things in the right order for my case. There is not set thing for everyone so it makes it a little difficult and there are variables as well.

I think my best bet is to first start with the gastrointestinal system. If that isn't healthy, than nothing will be from what I've read. And I should be getting back some good info from my CDSA from genova. I already had one test showing an elevated candida level. Then I think I need to treat the GI tract with meds. Like take an anti-candida medication such as dificulan or something else (can you recommend anything)? And while I am taking the candida med, also take a probiotic.

I think this is what might have messed me up when I took the Keflex antibiotic. The keflex probably wiped out all my good bacteria, and then let the candida get worse or something else get worse like a parasite/infection. Or possibly the keflex wiped out the good bacteria and really weakend my immune system and that caused me problems. Not sure yet. What do you may have happened? It is interesting that I took the keflex and all my CNS symptoms came back including numbness in arms.

But I am not sure how to approach this. If the CDSA doesn't mention a parasite, should I just take something anyways to be safe. I am more into taking pharmaceuticals vs. naturals. I have thought about albenza for worms, alina for protozoa, or other combos. I know someone who is great with trying different combo's of meds to help with parasites.

In a sense, I am trying the Remove phase of the four r's of functional medicine and getting rid of pathogens.

Then hopefully my gi tract is a little better and I am getting healthier. If not, then I think it would be best to start some serious detoxification. With a liver flush and chelation using dmps for mercury. And possibly other things.

Or should I possibly consider doing a detoxification first before addressing the GI tract. Like starting with the chelation for mercury. The doc I am meeting with this week might want me to do a dmps challenge test to see what my levels are. I have waited on this though because I am unsure about a few things. The main thing is that I don't want to be chelating anything if my GI tract is messed up and my detoxification pathways are messed up and the mercury that is suppossed to be chelated out just ends up getting reabsorbed and causing me more problems.

On the other hand, the mercury itself could be causing alot of problems with my gi tract and detoxification to begin with and by chelating this, I could start to get healthy. I am not sure what to do. I have read that you should try to optimize your GI tract before thinking about chelating, but I am still a little unsure in my case.

What to do you think I should do as far as a plan goes? There is not any studies on this to refer to and while there is some information, there is not one set thing you can go to that says follow this plan and you will get healthy.
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Old 03-03-2010, 03:02 PM
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It looks about the same as Clarks flushes. I have her protocols listed on this page. You may need to do more than one round of each. I never did do the apple part myself. If apples upset you don't do them. Try pears, plums.

https://www.healthsalon.org/385/the-liver-flush/

I want to be clear when I talk about parasites I am not just talking about parasites in the bowel, but in the blood and liver and other organs as well. Even the tiniest of microbs that hook on to red and white blood cells. Most of these are microscopic but large ones can be found in most of these areas also

Clarks protocols will open the oragans of elimation and MMS will do the final slaughter of negative microbes after the flushes are done with out the negative side effects of Keflex or other antibiotics etc. I think Heel detox protocols are a great idea also.
When I was extensively tested some years ago there were next to no heavy metals or other strange chemicals in me, I credit that to the heel products that I have been using for some time. But again, I do recommend the flushes before or at least concurrently even with Heel. Critical to all is the necessity to have your organs of elimination open. Once things are moving well there you should feel at least slightly better. Then you have prepared the way for deeper detox, like heavy metals, drugs, and other pollutants.

You didn't mention ulcers...Ulcers can be caused by bugs other than H pylori. It just happens to be one of the few they can manage to find. I strongly recommend Ozone water for you for this stomach issue. Since you are already on a ton of antacids they should be continued until the ulcer is gone to prevent further erosion. You can purchase an inexpensive ozonator to make ozone water here. You will need to drink 4 glasses a day for about three weeks. It does not taste bad. If you decide to do it let me know and I will give instructions. I have gotten rid of several ulcers for others this way and avoided antibiotic use and in general Ozone will help with detox of your whole system. https://www.enaly.com/ozx-300u.html Everyone I know who has used ozone water for ulcers has been able to stop the antacids in about a week, against my recommendation btw. But they became pain free so I guess it was ok, but ozone has analgesic qualities so I thought it could be premature. They didn't have any problems. All became quite well. This part can be done as soon as you get your ozonator. Healing those ulcers is critical to restore proper nutrition and metabolism. After they are healed, thats when you stop the antacids and start the Betain HCL (with preferable pepsin) with meals. This will greatly help prevent further microbal invasion via entry through the gut. It is necessary to understand that ulcers form when there is not enough hydrochloric acid in the stomach to kill the pathogens that come in on our food. Those acid secreted cells need to be turned on again and taking acid sometimes stimulates them to function again. If it does in your case, you won't have to take the betain HCL forever.... but remember if symptoms of reflux start to return you have to return to the acid supplement.

You should also be on general digestive enzymes and Wobezyme makes a very good product and you can find knock offs too. You are right in thinking that getting things straight with the gut is critical. After the getting the gut right, the organs of elimination open and parasites and microbes we will see what is left when the dust clears. Getting your stomach right can take you a long way on repairing your hormonal system!

The dark field micrscope will tell you flat on the spot if your candida is responding to the treatments you and your doctor have chosen. You will either SEE it in the blood, or you won't.

I've had the opportunity to view test results from a dark field microscope study. It is amazing... even being able to show what nutritional deficiences are happening.

You do not want to do a detox of mercury until you improve your organs of elimination first but I will guess that some of that Heel stuff will move some out. kidney, colon, and improve liver function. If you have mercury fillings you will have to have them out and let me know so I can help you find the very best expert in this arena so you don't end up with root canals. Much progress in dentisry these last few years! I would do everything orally and though vitamins and homeopathy before subjecting myself to IV chelation therapy. There are other ways, and far less costly and time consuming

You say your adenoma is nonfunctioning. I would guess that that is good but if nonfunctioning means the same a benign there is reason for some concern as benign sometimes switches to active carcinoma. MMS may take care of this possibly. After you have done about a year of detox I would have them go look at that again.

I have not heard that mercury has an affinity for the GI tract. What I do know is that many different kinds of cells will hold mercury. When it is stimulated to release it goes via the lymph to the blood stream to the liver and is dumped into the GI tract with liver secretions. If you do not take chlorella tablets it will re-enter the blood stream thought the lining of the gut creating a perpetual loop during the detox protocol. When the protocol ends the mercury redeposits in tissues again, often the heart and brain. So chlorella is essential on any mercury detox. I think 1 gram tablet a day does it but I never personally felt confident with that dosage and would take one gram in am and one in pm

I do want to mention that there is plenty of evidence out there that MMS will improve the health of the red and white blood cells which will be critical for recovery. Really look into it.

No there is no one set plan. All people are different with different health issues requiring protocols designed specifically for them. Some docs have protocols they generally follow and then design specific add ons for individual needs.

The things that I know will bring absolute results are the Clark detox protocols, Heel detox and MMS. I would not leave anything out.

I suggest you write up your game plan so you don't get lost in it.

Then I would also make a plan for the supplements you need to take.

I would feel better about it if the doc you were going to was experienced in all this. I wish I knew someone in florida. You cannot get blood out of a stone, and I classify most MD's as stones. On the other hand I have heard of clinics in florida that do some really cutting edge alternative medicine... I just never kept track of who they are. One of my criteria for selecting a physican, either naturopathic or medical would be if he does or has a staff member who does dark field microscopy. Only through this form of diagnostics will you really know what is going on with your body.... These exams tell you things that the regular lab tests just can't even begin to get near! and I just can't emphasize this too much. It really is critical for the type of healing you require. I know there are people in florida that do it. You wll have to search. It will certainly assit the doctor to speed your progress by knowing what is really going on and by being able to determine what is working ans what is not.

For general supplements I would order everything on line. You can get good products here:
www.iherb.com which also has ALL the Heel products at discount price! To find specific ones you have to type its name in the search bar.. and they may have the detox kits too, haven't looked, but you can purchase those detox kit remedies separately also.
www.vitacost.com has good prices on vitamin c and tumeric
www.vitalady.com for vitamin D3. She carries my prefered brand Biotec but she bottles the same think under her vitalady label a little cheaper.
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Old 03-03-2010, 08:14 PM
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No doubt, you have some serious health issues to deal with.

If you want to lose weight you must cut back on sugar, especially high fructose corn syrup. Also stay away from the diet stuff as well because they contain aspartame or sucralose, which are neuro toxins, and will actually make you eat more, not less.

You can't have soda pop, any processed food that contains fructose, and no alcohol of any kind, not even one beer. I would guess that last round of antibiotics killed off all the good bacteria in your gut, and now yeast has taken over. Sugar and alcohol fuel the growth of yeast, which is the last thing you need.

Avoid antibiotics, for they are made from molds or fungus, and will only increase the problem. Also avoid chlorine, which means no tap water. Drink R.O. water with a pinch of sea salt for minerals. Also use sea salt in place of table salt. Avoid fluoride, MSG, and peperoni- type lunch meats, because they are contaminated with nitrates/nitrites.Read the ingredient labels and look up what you don't understand. That is a must.

Anything you put into your body will react in either a positive manner or a negative manner. There is no neutral. Start treating your body like a temple, not a garbage dump.

Besides clean air and clean water, you need vitamins, minerals, and nutrients. That means a diet high in organic veggies, fruits, nuts and seeds. If you eat meat, eat free range organic meat, not the toxic poison from the feed lot. These animals are vaccinated, and fed antibiotics. They say so they don't get sick, but the truth is the antibiotics are in the animal feed, and it is common knowledge that if you want to fatten up an animal, just give it some antibiotics.

Take a good quality multivitamin. One that is made from whole foods. They are not cheap, but you usually get what you pay for. You will also need a good quality probiotic daily to rebuild the good flora in the gut. It is this good bacteria that produces B12, and without this, you won't have energy. Because of your size, I would suggest 10,000 I.U. of D3 per day til summer, then have your blood checked. (D Hydroxy 25) Next, I would suggest 600 mg per day of magnesium. (from citrate) Then 50 mg per day of iodine, in both iodine and iodide forms. Lugols iodine contains both. Iodine controls the thyroid, and the thyroid controls metabolism. If you are deficient in iodine, and I am willing to bet that you are, you will never lose weight, no matter how much you exercise.

You also need alot of C in divided doses throughout the day because it lasts only about 4 hours. Start with 1000 mg every 4 or 5 hours and go up from there. See if you can get up to 20,000 mg per day total. The more you can take the better your health will be. Keep in mind however that C is ascorbic acid, which may react with the acid in your stomach. You may get some rumbling, gas, etc., but try to work past that, or take a buffered form.

Vitamin E as in mixed tocopherols 2000 I.U. per day. That will help thin your blood so the heart doesn't have to work so hard. Also fish oil or flax seed oil for omega 3, at least a couple of grams per day.

I would also suggest lots of antioxidants, such as extracts or fruit powders. That way you get the benefit of tons of fruit without the sugar. I stated earlier to stay away from fructose for it is a poison and that is true. It is also true that there is a small amount of fructose in fruit, however, God did it right because with the poison he also included antidote... fibre. That is why fruit has alot of fibre.

We used to eat at least 100 grams of fibre per day, now we eat 12. That is not even close to enough. 40 to 50 grams of fibre per day should be your goal.

Every 50 years or so a supplement comes along that is just awesome. Resveratrol is the latest one that everyone should be taking. Some resveratrol capsules on the market today provide so much resveratrol that over a thousand bottles of red wine would equal one capsule. One of the biggest advantages of taking resveratrol is that it kills yeast, mold, and fungus better than prescription antifungals. Considering most people are overflowing with these organisms, resveratrol should be taken by all.

On a final note Pete, I don't know what your blood pressure is, or your blood sugar, or your cholesterol, C-reactive protein, homocysteine, etc., etc.. but if you have any of these conditions and you want to get them all into the normal zone as quickly as possible, the best thing to do is fast for 4 to 7 days. Even 3 days might be enough. This will cause everything to reset. Just drink plenty of pure water. Once you stop eating garbage, exercise (even walking to start is great) and getting proper nutrition, the weight will just start to drop off. Good luck with your health plan. PBD

Sugar: The Bitter Truth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM
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Old 03-04-2010, 08:51 AM
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Pete

You could well have mercury issues but I notice that in your list of tests there is no mention of liver function tests.

The most worrying thing is the low cholesterol levels which can indicate liver damage, in particular from Hepatitis B.

Most doctors dont test for this because the regular symptoms, such as jaundice and dark urine, are not always present until the later stages of the disease.

Dirty tattoo needles have been implicated in the spread of Hep B in the past, with the growth of the amount of tatooing going on over the past few decades.

Being overweight can also cause a fatty liver and impede liver function.

Taking oral testosterone, especially anabolic steroids, can also cause liver damage.

If you have not already had liver tests done, I would get these test done urgently because you dont want to delay especially if you have HepB.

https://www.labtestsonline.org.uk/und...disease-2.html

A malfunctioning liver could also mean a build up of toxic bile causing osophagous reflex symptoms and an inability to get rid of mercury.

https://gut.bmj.com/content/44/5/598.abstract

.

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Old 03-10-2010, 01:10 PM
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I received the results of a few tests this week. I am not sure if everyone knows about these tests or what the levels mean, but if you do and recognize something that could help, please let me know. My CDSA from genova showed very low levels of lacto and bifido bacteria, and good levels of E coli. It also had 4 strains of other bacteria that were bad I believe, and they were klebsiella pneumoniae, citrobacter freundii, streptococcus agalactiae, and gamma hemolytic streptoccous. So essentially, not very many good bacteria and a few bad ones. My digestion showed low chymotrypsin and high putrefactive scfa's. High beta glucuronidase and in scfa distrubution, low acetate and high n-butyrate. Absorbtion was all in range, but all were on the high end of range. Eosinophil protein x was high.

On the spectracell test, I was deficient in magnesium. And close to be low in copper and chromium.

On my hair test, I was high in bismuth, gadolinium, mercury, and uranium. And for the nutrients I was low in sodium, vanadium, manganese. And fairly low in chromium, copper, molybdenum, iron. Lithum and potassium were non existent, but not sure if it its bad or not due to reference range.

Some other lab results showed the I had the EBV virus and the HHV6 virus. And I also had low carbon dioxide level in blood at 19, which has never happened before. Also had a NCV, nerve test, done and it showed some damage to both my right and left hand. The results from my capsule endoscopy were normal so there was no masses, ulcers, or internal bleeding, etc in my small intestine.

My doc recommended that I take 2 immune system supplements to help fight the viruses and restore my immunity. He felt that my immune system was probably very weakend by the dybosis, viruses, infections, and other things that I are going on. One is a oil of oregano supplement which will be could for the immune system and for killing any pathogenic problems in my gi tract. He also recommended a probiotic. I decided to chose Dr. Ohira's professional formula based on the reviews. Also the th 10 strain in his formula could help kill off other harmful pathogens in gi tract. And we are replacing the magnesium with a supplement.

He also mentioned taking possibly taking iodoral to help prevent the boils infections I have had in the past.

So in summary, it looks like there is an imbalance of good vs. bad bacteria in the stomach. This is causing me some problems with digestion and absorption. My liver is recirculating bad toxins to much. There is also inflammation or tissue damage going on inside gi tract.

I am high on a few toxic elements, but nothing seems way to high. I am low on many minerals and nutrient elements such as what I mentioned above. I am deficient in magnesium, and close to being defiecient in copper and chromium.

Have some issues with viruses, a little nerve damage, and a low carbon dioxide level for the first time.

When I have been looking at everything lately, I think one of the main reasons why have been so hungry all the time is my lack of stomach acid (Hypochlorhydria). For the past few months I have been looking at things like a possibly candida/parasites or lack of pancreas enzymes or just anything really that could cause my enormous appetite, and I might have overlooked the biggest factor might be stomach acid. When I took the anti-acids in excess for 2-3 years, this probably really messed things up. It makes alot of sense. And also, I have read lately that lack of stomach acid could cause a voracious appetite and feel like your virtually starving all the time. I have noticed that alot of times people with low stomach acid are defiecient in many minerals such as me, and they could be anemic as well as in my case.

In addition, something else I didn't mention that is most likely related to lack of stomach acid. When I do take a PPI like nexium or prilosec, my appetite increases 100x what it is now. This is probably a direct result of the meds decreasing my stomach acid and me not being able to break down food properly.

The question then turns to dealing with this issue. Since I have an ulcer, (small one), I don't think its a good idea to take the betaine hcl. Even though I read some naturopaths think otherwise. I think I am going to take the advice of getting an ozonator to heal the ulcers and help detox this system. This has been recommended to me by someone else as on another forum as well. It seems great, but I was wondering if there is any side effects. I read somewhere that one of the only problems might be that if you had cancer or maybe something else, that the extra oxygen from the ozonator would allow the cancer to grow faster. However, I was tested up and down for cancer, and do not have it. Is there any other complications that might be important to know before trying it?

In regards to trying to do something about the low stomach acid now, I read somewhere that eating a salad with a vinegar type dressing before your meal might be able to help. Is this good? And does anyone know anything else I might be able to do before I can start taking betaine hcl to help me with this issue, besides ozonated water. Maybe a type of food/natural liquid or maybe taking something with just pepsin in it. I haven't found too many that only have pepsin it. One product was okra pepsin e3 that used to be recommended years ago, but have not heard to much about it lately. Any thoughts?

About the ozanated water, when should I start taking it? Should I wait to try until it I am take the other supplements first or try to start it asap? I do not want to flood my body with too many things at one time, but I also want to get healthier as quickly as possible.

In regards to enzymes, do you think it is worth it to start taking them now with everything else, or wait a little? I feel that healing the ulcer and starting with the betaine hcl probably is the first priority. But enzymes could be important and also maybe something like ox bile or bile supplement to help break down fat. Not sure here.

So the current plan is to take the immune system supplements for the next 30 days, which will help with the viruses and killing pathogens in stomach. Replace good bacteria with probiotics. Replace magnesium. Maybe hold off on iodoral for now. And maybe take the ozonated water in the next 30 days or not. Maybe take enzymes or other things. Will need your advice on this. Am I missing anything or would you do anything different. I do not have an unlimited supply of money so I have to pick and choose what would give me the greatest benefit. Thanks for reading.
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Old 03-10-2010, 01:26 PM
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Ozone is good. It is the most benign way to treat an ulcer. Other things can do it but ozone will bring you no greif. Start it as soon as you get the ozonator. Healing your stomach is a priority. Ozone water will detox lots of other stuff too.


MMS will get rid of most of those pathogens and is known for eliminating EBV and its variants. MMS would likely get rid of the ulcer too for that matter but you may not be able to tolerate much at first. Boosting your immune system is good. Some of the microbes you mentioned are common to most people. It is just a mater of keeping them at subclinical levels. Most everyone carries strep, K pneumonia etc. It only becomes a problem when you get sick. It is not the microbe that makes you sick it is the microbe that gets a grip on you when your immune system goes down. Its the immune system going down that is what is the true sickness... this occurs from poor diet, toxins, emotional imbalance, stress, depression. Microbes only make you sick when you get a massive invasion that overwhelms the system or you are exposed to a microbe that the immune system cannot modify for and attack... it usually finds it way though over a few days to a week or so.... the length of time of most common illnessess.

Cure that ulcer before you start any HCL. Enzymes help break down protiens..so I would hold on them too till the ulcer is gone. It won't take long once you get on to it.
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Old 03-10-2010, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arrowwind09 View Post
It looks about the same as Clarks flushes. I have her protocols listed on this page. You may need to do more than one round of each. I never did do the apple part myself. If apples upset you don't do them. Try pears, plums.

https://www.healthsalon.org/385/the-liver-flush/
.................

Concerning my ulcer, I do not want take any anti-acids because they make me feel much hungrier which is very bad in my case. I have been virtually just dealing with the heartburn for the last few months and taking a quarter of prilosec if it gets really bad. Can I do the ozonated water by itself and that will heal the ulcer? I am hoping this is the case.

Also, how will I know the ulcer has healed. I just had an endoscopy done and do not really want to ask my Doc for another in say a month or two. At the same, I want to take start the ozonated water and take the betaine hcl as quickly as possible.

I don't think it is good idea to take the betaine hcl if the ulcer has not healed. So you see I am in a little dilemma.

Is there something I could as a safety measure. For example, take the ozonated water for say 6 weeks or longer just to be sure the ulcer has healed. Then start with betaine HCL. This seems like it may work, not sure though.

Or maybe take the ozonated water combined with stomach healing supplement or something for a while, then go on the betaine hcl.

I did the heel detox kit and did not notice too much of a difference. Felt a little better while on it, but nothing major.

My doc does do live blood cell analysis, which is or similar to dark field microscopy. So that is good. I will do in testing in the future to monitor my progress.

Also, the doc I am working with seems very confident that I will be able to get healthy again, and start feeling alot better by the summer. That was great to hear.
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Old 03-10-2010, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlyBird View Post
Hi Pete, welcome to our forum.
The one thing that stands out to me is your weight and having to urinate so
frequently as well as constantly feeling hungry. Have you been tested for
Diabetes or pre-diabetes? Diabetes can adversely effect your vision, your limbs,
energy and overall how you feel.

Eating frequently is not too bad depending on how much you eat and what
you eat at any one time? I agree with Arrow about what she tells you to cut
out - sugars, etc. Small amounts only; teaspoons not tablespoons!
If Diabetic you need to be very careful what type of carbs you eat. Potatoes
are a no-no, as are pastas, any white flour products, etc.
Beginning a meal with 1/2 a grapefruit may help a bit with weight, as well as
giving you natural Vit C. It also can cut your appetite back a bit.
Taking antibiotics can tear up some people's digestive systems. A friend of mine
gets diahreah every time she has to use an antibiotic.
I do wish you much good luck with getting your health back; you seem to have
great spirit and fortitude in your quest.
BTW, how old are you now?

I have been tested for diabetes and it is negative. Both kinds. I agree about the antibiotics and think they depleted alot of good bacteria in my stomach over the years. Thanks for wishing me good luck. I am praying that it all works out soon. I am 26 years old.
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Old 03-10-2010, 01:38 PM
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Don't be impatient. Do things in the correct order. I know you don't feel well but you will get there.

Heal that ulcer first. If it is H pylori they have a blood test for it. That should confirm if it is gone, but your gut will feel much better, and thats what counts. Anyway I would ask for an h pylori blood test 3 weeks post ozone therapy.

Get a glass jar and put pure clean distilled water in it, into the fridge.

When you get your ozonator bubble ozone into one quart of ice cold water for 20 to 30 minutes. Drink 8 ounces. repeat for 4 times a day. You can do more if you tolerate it well, and most people do. But 4 glasses is sufficient. One hour before meals is best. Your stomach needs to be empty. You want that ozone working on your ulcer not your sandwich.

Ozone water is good for 24 hours if kept in the fridge. If it doesn't taste and smell like ozone, make anew.

you can learn lots about ozone here:
https://www.healthsalon.org/250/learn...ozone-therapy/
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Old 03-10-2010, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pinballdoctor View Post
No doubt, you have some serious health issues to deal with.

If you want to lose weight you must cut back on sugar, especially high fructose corn syrup. Also stay away from the diet stuff as well because they contain aspartame or sucralose, which are neuro toxins, and will actually make you eat more, not less.
......

In regards to fasting, I have read about juice fasting as a good way for detox and weight loss. I looked it up a little and it seems some people really like it. Are you familiar with this and do you have any advice in terms of what type of juicer to get and what type of receipes are the best?

About the eating, exercise, nutrition, etc, I actually do a very good job of this. I eat a very well balanced diet of vegetables, fruit, meat, etc and I exercise about as much as I can for someone in my position. I have been running sprints and jogging for a long time and combine that with other cardio and lifting weights, at least 3-4 times a week. I just had to stop sprinting because my plantar facisilitis is so bad I can barely walk for 2 days after this.

See this one of things that has been the most frustrating for me. With the way I eat and exercise, I should look like someone who treats their body very good, but this is not the case. And I think alot of it has to do with what I have going with my body like problems in the gi tract, detoxifying things, etc.

Concerning reservatrol, do you think I should wait to add it in a month or so after I get done taking everything else so far in my plan.
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Old 03-10-2010, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liverock View Post
Pete

You could well have mercury issues but I notice that in your list of tests there is no mention of liver function tests.

The most worrying thing is the low cholesterol levels which can indicate liver damage, in particular from Hepatitis B.

Most doctors dont test for this because the regular symptoms, such as jaundice and dark urine, are not always present until the later stages of the disease.

Dirty tattoo needles have been implicated in the spread of Hep B in the past, with the growth of the amount of tatooing going on over the past few decades.

Being overweight can also cause a fatty liver and impede liver function.

Taking oral testosterone, especially anabolic steroids, can also cause liver damage.

If you have not already had liver tests done, I would get these test done urgently because you dont want to delay especially if you have HepB.

https://www.labtestsonline.org.uk/und...disease-2.html

A malfunctioning liver could also mean a build up of toxic bile causing osophagous reflex symptoms and an inability to get rid of mercury.

https://gut.bmj.com/content/44/5/598.abstract

.

I am not sure why my cholesterol levels are low yet, but it could be from liver damage as you mentioned. I was tested for all the hepatitis awhile ago and came back negative.

When I had a ct scan of stomach, the docs told me my liver was a little big. No deposits or masses though.

On my CDSA, one of the levels showed that my liver was recirculating toxins too much and this could definitley be causing me problems. I suspected that it was doing this. I requested a liver detoxifation test with my doc, but he wants to wait a little. I looked at the tests you mentoned and will discuss them with my Doc.

About the toxic bile, this could very well be applying to me. I am not sure what is going on with my bile, but I know cholesterol and bile and very connected and if my cholesterol numbers are abnormal, then bile is probably being affected.

Do you think I should take a supplement to help with the bile. Something like ox bile or similar one? I don't know if the ezymes supplements out there also add it something for bile or you have to take it seperate. Or anything else in general that you might recommended to address the liver and or bile issues?
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Old 03-10-2010, 03:50 PM
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the first thing with the liver is to do a liver cleanse as mentioned in my first post. I provided all links you need. MMS will do much to detox the liver also. But I would do the liver cleanse first to mechanically remove anything that may be slowing things up. The ozone water may also help your liver to a degree.
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