After hearing different stories about hospital and senior care, I am beginning to believe that this is the case. The stories really make you wonder. Hospitals and Dr offices are places to stay away from. Don't get me wrong I think there are a lot of good people in these places but people make mistakes, no matter how hard we try not to Murphy's Law you know.
My 83 year old mom was in a supposed new, state of the art, senior home,
complete with medical staff. While moving her from her wheel chair to her bed they had a "problem" with the hoyer, and she broke her leg, she got by the gangrene in the leg and by the time they realized it she needed amputation,
She died the next day after the surgery.

So what the heck does Murphy's Law have to do with euthansia? You are making a monumental jump.


Sorry you lost your mom but it was not due to euthansia and you are promoting fear mongering. Your mother died as the result of an accident. Now there may have been negilgence involved, I don't know. But not euthansia.

Euthansia is not performed in the US except in Oregon under extenuating circumstances and 10 foot high stack of documentation, hence very few get to have it even tough many may beg for it. Since its inception about 455 people have gone through the process of application and received euthansia.

The actual reality in our current system of medical care is that they prod and probe and do indignified acts to the elderly to try to continue life, when they have neither the physical stamina nor the will to live, often against their will, forced on by family who cannot cope with death and some doctors who fear law suits.


If they were going to euthanize your mother they would have done it before the $30,000 surgery, which most likely medicare paid for, paid for by the state, not an insurance company looking to cut costs.

and a little futrher education on the "death panel" fear mongering that has been going on....

All the rediculous mongering about death panels is exactly what it is. Rediculous mongering.

The elderly should have the right of choice to the kind of care they receive under extenuating circumstances... This "death panel discussion" as called by the right wing fear mongers is actually a discussion between the patient and their doctor to determine what kind of care they wish to have if they should come into critical condition. It is a signed form by the doctor and the patient as to whether advanced medical techniques will be used like CPR, intubation, artifical venilation, IV therapy, antibiotics. The document can be revised at any time per the request of the patient. This form is called a Living Will or Advanced Directives.

The document also states who will speak and make medical decisions for the patient if they should be unable to to do it for themselves. This person is chosen by the patient and usually is a trusted family member. It then becomes the trusted ones obligation to enact medical choices that they think the patient would want to receive under all the variations of issuses that come up. It gives medical staff a directive to know how to proceed according to the patients wishes... so this is what it is, this "death panel," the right wing nut cases have been mongering on.... designed to scare the begeebers out of you, which it would if you don't take the time to find out what it really is, not by just buying into all the propaganda out there.


The health care bill will provide payment for doctors to have this discussion. Currently doctors do have the discussion, and frequently, but they have not been able to bill for it under ICD code regulation., It would change that so that this discussion, a one on one with the doctor or sometimes the medical social worker and patient, which often takes up to an hour, and at times necessitates more than one visit, can be paid for by medicare and private insurance.

__________________
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I appreciate your comments, and like I said I have absolutely no intention or no desire to "Fear Monger" or put any medical or health care worker down. They have a job I personally do not believe I could handle for very long. Like most jobs they are thankless, stressful, overworked, and underpaid, but being human they do make mistakes,and Murphy's Law says these mistakes can and will usually happen at the most inopportune moments.

But, I have to question, how does a 90 pd woman end up with a broken leg being transferred from a wheelchair to a bed with two attentive staff doing the transfer, how does she end up getting gangrene so bad they have to amputate her leg almost at the hip without being it being noticed earlier, especially when she is supposed to be getting extra care. I also know sometimes in life even our best is not good enough, S@*t just happens. Routine surgery is not routine in my view and health care is not just health care.

Each day in the United States, there are five to 10 incorrect surgical procedures performed, some with devastating effects, the researchers noted. Typical problems are surgery performed on the wrong site or wrong side of the body, using an incorrect procedure or using it on the wrong patient.https://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/n...ory_92076.html

(If that is the case what about what happens with health care workers
in senior and nursing homes and residences that we don't hear about.my comment)

Among the cases the researchers looked at were 212 adverse events, where wrong procedures were performed or the procedure was performed in the wrong patient, or at the wrong site. In addition, there were 130 "close calls," where a problem was recognized before the procedure was done.https://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/n...ory_92076.html

Implementation (of 19 safety checks) is sometimes spotty, partly because a procedure can become so routine that staff members just go through the motions without really checking each item. (Murphy's Law?)
https://www.boston.com/news/local/mas...deaths/?page=2

A new study has found that the surgical death rate in hospitals is not just determined by the rate of complications but also by how those complications are handled.
The study involved more than 84,000 people who underwent surgery in U. S. hospitals and discovered a twofold difference in surgical deaths between hospitals with the lowest rate and those with the highest.
https://topnews.us/content/27482-hand...urgical-deaths

If every operating room in the United States adopted the surgical checklist, the nation could save between $15 billion and $25 billion a year on the costs of treating avoidable complications, according to calculations by the authors. https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...011402831.html

Maybe euthanasia is not the right word, is it incompetence, what is the right word? If it is your mother, father, son, daughter,spouse or heaven forbid you, yourself was on the operating table and died, so sorry I am having a bad day, doesn't cut it, no pun intended.

Yes I am hurt and angry because I feel it was a waste and we did not even get a I'm sorry for your loss. One careless action after another is the way I see it. A routine hoyer lift, a routine broken leg, a routine recovery from a broken leg, a routine surgery. Was it a routine death as well.? ALL ACCORDING TO MURPHY complete with a little butterfly effect thrown in.

I apologize for venting, but it seems like a series of such stupid mistakes to me, and life goes on for some of us, while others have to deal with the loss.

It's difficult to say.
Everyone who has studied vitamin D3 will be able to confirm that below 32ng/ml it is certain you will not be able to absorb sufficient calcium from your diet to meet you daily needs.
Those who have studied the issue a little more deeply will also know there is a difference between absorbing sufficient calcium and controlling it so it goes into your bones and stays there. The astrocyte brain cells use calcium to communicate with the neurones and to process omega 3 into the forms neurones require. So in order for your brain to continue to function calcium has to be dragged from your bones to meet your brains requirements. This continual recycling of calcium in/out of bones to supply brain function is wasteful and damaging and will end if you keep your 25(OH)D above 42ng/ml.

Go into any old folks home and you will find EVERY PATIENT is Vitamin D deficient.
That is why when they fall their bones break.
That is why their immune systems are so poor they are unable to deal with infection. In order to have a reserve store of Vitamin D3 in tissues we all require a 25(OH)D level above 50ng/ml and to have sufficient to allow human breast milk to flow replete with D3 the level has to be 58ng/ml.

By allowing old folk to remain vitamin D3 deficient more of them will fall, break bones, get infected and then die. You can do something about this and it doesn't cost much. one daily for 8~12 weeks should restore status to above 50ng/ml.
Then get a 25(OH)D POSTAL TEST at cost price
Then maybe reduce intake to 1000iu/daily/D3 for each 25lbs weight, that should then keep you about 55ng/ml.
(you need more at first to fill up the vitamin D reserve tanks, once they are filled you only need to cover your daily needs)

What would we call it if nursing care establishments didn't provide proper nutrition to those in their care or didn't make sure they were able to eat it?

What would we call it if those care homes didn't allow access to water?

If we are to stay healthy Vitamin D3 is as essential as food and water and the failure to provide sufficient amounts to meet basic daily needs is tantamount to deliberate neglect.

Older community-dwelling adults with low serum 25(OH)D levels are at higher risk of all-cause and cardiovascular disease mortalityThe lower your vitamin D status the sooner you die.

Well, what you are talking about is not euthansia.

What happened to your mother is not uncommon. Unfortuante yes, but not uncommon. It is so easy to break legs in these old people. Most likely she had significant osteoporosis, and likely undiagnosed. Was she diabetic, or having other vasculatory issues? If she was bedridden as it sounds she was, I guarantee she had vascular issues, even if they were not diagnosed. This could lead to gangrene. I have seen patients that can get fractures merely from repositioning them in bed even when done gently and with the most care, they are that frail.

Many years of nutritional depravation, a failing digestive system and general old age and inactivity creates these situations. The current system has no clue how to prevent these problems and they will never be able to prevent such "accidents" and their serious consequences unless people are educated to right diet and liftstyle long long before they require nursing home help. Most people are nutriotionally depraved most of their lives and they don't realize it. It can bring about chronic disease and weakness, and system failures as age progresses.

We are not educated to understand the aging process and what occurs. Nor are we educated in how to forstall such difficulties.

Ted is right about the vitamin D thing, but it is only one aspect of a complex systemic decline. Fracture got your mom, hemorragh another, infection another, dementia another, cancer another, heart attack for another. They (conventional medcial staff) don't know a thing about how to prevent these diseases that eventually take our loved ones. The only recourse is to educate yourself and try to prevent it in yourself and others around you that you care about.....

And on top of all that you will find that most people really don't want to learn and change the behavior that would lead to such decline, illness and tragedy.

Yes getting old and its inherit problems are a b$*^#, it is cold comfort though, and I realize "accidents" happen that is also cold comfort. I will be the first to admit when repeating certain task repeatedly, while they become second nature, can easily lead to a false sense of security and or rout action where we are thinking of some other facet of our life and not giving the task the attention it deserves. As far as my mother was concerned,at this point no matter what feelings I have with regards to her passing the point remains, she is gone,and the healing process is a long slow one, again cold comfort. Thanks for letting me vent.

I have serious issues with nursing homes and have heard tons of horror stories. We had to put my grandmother in one back in late 96 and her mental facilities were pretty good (she was 98). After a yr her mental facilities went to hell and I noticed that when we visited her, the lunch was a small hot dog, a short can of soda and a cookie. God damn jackoffs! If they would feed the residents fresh food I am certain their health would improve in many cases.