Vitamin C's Role In Combatting Hypertension

[nightowl]

\r\n \r\n Howard,
\r\n
\r\nMaybe the doseage wasn\'t high enough, or maybe they should have added lysine, as suggested in this poor resolution video with Linus Pauling for cardiovascular disease. I wonder if anyone else has tried this? My first husband died partially as a result of cardiovascular disease at 46 years of age. Actually the video suggestion was for angina pectoris but, as I read in a good article online, angina is a result of Coronary Heart Disease (CHD) and the weakened heart muscles due to lack of oxygen caused by the heart not receiving an adequate blood supply. Hmmmm....you\'re talking hyper..and I\'m looking at hypotension, but my object is clearing and repairing the arteries back to health, possibly. ~~~nightowl~~~
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\r\nClick on the link, then scroll all the way to the top and click on "Linus Pauling Video: Unified Theory of Cardiovascular Disease"
\r\nhttps://vitamincfoundation.org/videos/#BROWNSTEIN\r\n

[Harry Hirsute]

\r\n \r\n NightOwl,
\n
\nIt\'s very, very rare to find a vitamin C study that even attempts to reach a truly therapeutic levels (anywhere near the bowel tolerance level).
\n
\nFor quite some time now, I\'ve been encouraging Owen Fonorow (who you\'d know from the VCF) to put together a pilot study, to test the vitamin C/lysine combo, using optimal dosages of each.
\n
\nSo far, Mathias Rath, M.D. is the closest example of someone who\'s tried to do this. But sadly, even the dosage he chose to use was inadequate (by most accounts).
\n
\nPersonally, I use Pauling\'s combo (and then some) but I don\'t know how effectively it\'s working for me. I\'m using it mainly for preventive purposes (I think ).\r\n

[nightowl]

\r\n \r\n I\'ve heard some pros and cons about Linus Pauling, but he seemed real intent on getting the message in the video out to the people. I bought L-lysine tonight but was only able to find 500 mg capsules in the store with little stock to choose from, so just to see if it agreed with me I took 1000 mg L-lysine and 2ooo mg Vitamin C w/ Rose Hips tonight. I will gradually increase it. I have elevated fibrinogen so I figure anything that helps clean the arteries is a plus. My theory is that part of my shortage of oxygen with COPD is because my blood can\'t circulate the oxygen with the arteries clogged up. And I\'ve read that inflammation causes fibrinogen to be formed....with elevated C-Reactive Protein indicating I that have inflammation, I\'m probably creating more fibrinogen than my supplements can clear. It\'s a viscious circle. Also, lack of oxygen can cause the red blood cells to get very large and they have trouble circulating too. I am waiting for results of blood tests now so I will have a better idea how I\'m doing in a few days.
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\r\nI will be having a Medicare physical pretty soon and I want to have the carotid (?) artery checked. I have bad stiffness and pain in my neck, but it is relieved a lot when I drink good pomegranate juice once a day....if I let it slide and don\'t drink any, like today, I\'ll really pay the price by tomorrow. Just thought I\'d throw that in, in relation to cardiovascular supplements.
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\r\nnightowl\r\n

[nightowl]

\r\n \r\n Howard,
\r\n
\r\nI\'m very tired tonight so missed your point about the research! Keep after Owen Fonorow! There\'s money out there somewhere for this research if only some of those billionairs would donate something to humanity without expecting anything in return for a change! That\'s the kind of thing that makes Saint Peter polish up those Pearly Gates real pretty I imagine....if that isn\'t reward enough I don\'t know what is!
\r\n
\r\nWell, with you and I both taking the recommended amount of Vit. C and lysine hopefully we\'ll be able to help others ourselves. I need to look up the difference between L-lysine and lysine again. Also, did you find stronger lysine that 500 to 1000 mg? I have TwinLab 500 mg capsules right now but can probably find something better online.
\r\n
\r\nIf only someone would fund three or four major research projects on natural supplements that were known to improve health in most people, maybe it would be enough to make believers out of the public and get the pendulum to swing in the other direction. But then the FDA would call it a drug unless it was worded right on the label.
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\r\nGood luck and thanks for the come back,
\r\nnightowl\r\n

[Harry Hirsute]

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\r\n Originally Posted by nightowl\r\n \r\n

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I need to look up the difference between L-lysine and lysine again. Also, did you find stronger lysine that 500 to 1000 mg? I have TwinLab 500 mg capsules right now but can probably find something better online.

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Nightowl,
\n
\nL-lysine and lysine are one-and-the-same (to the best of my knowledge). The most common form of lysine available (in a supplemental form, for human consumption) is L-Lysine hydrochloride (again, to the best of my knowledge).
\n
\nThe only lysine I\'ve found, that is more than 1,000 mg per serving, are the lysine powders. I prefer capsules to powders (in most instances) so I just use the Now Foods brand 500mg lysine capsules.
\n
\nPS - Re: clinical trials on Pauling\'s therapy
\n
\nOwen hinted at possibly having found a source of funding - for a pilot study. I hope that pans out.\r\n

[Harry Hirsute]

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\r\n Originally Posted by nightowl\r\n \r\n

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I have bad stiffness and pain in my neck, but it is relieved a lot when I drink good pomegranate juice once a day....if I let it slide and don\'t drink any, like today, I\'ll really pay the price by tomorrow. Just thought I\'d throw that in, in relation to cardiovascular supplements.

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Nightowl,
\n
\nThat\'s an interesting observation about the pomegranate juice.
\n
\nI\'m a big fan of pomegranates (and their extracts). There is some science that supports what you\'re seeing - in regard to the pomegranate juice and improvements in circulation. I\'m sure that\'s probably why you\'re using it in the first-place.
\n
\nI recently posted a link (to an article) that summarized many of the circulation-enhancing supplements. I\'ll try to find it and add it as an edit to this post. You\'ll probably be familiar with most of what\'s mentioned in the article ... but, you never know.
\n
\nedit: https://www.naturalproductsinsider.co...vascular.html#\r\n

[Harry Hirsute]

\r\n \r\n Boss,
\n
\nYou\'re correct. Powders are almost always cheaper - as they require less processing. They also tend to contain fewer fillers.
\n
\nOne correction however: gelatin capsules do not contain gluten. I don\'t even think that "veggie-caps" contain gluten.
\n
\nGelatin can actually serve a nutritional purpose (mainly supporting connective-tissue) but it would require higher dosages than you\'d likely get from a handful of capsules.
\n
\nI mainly use capsules, instead of powders, for the convenience factor. I\'m often on the go and don\'t want to mess with mixing powders. Also, many of the supplements I take aren\'t very palatable (or very soluble in water).\r\n

[Boss]

\r\n \r\n Interesting, I understood some time back that some Gelatin capsules had a substance in it, unsuitable for people with an IBD, presumably Gluten.
\n
\nInteresting. If they do\'nt then fair enough .\r\n

[Harry Hirsute]

\r\n \r\n Boss,
\n
\nI could be wrong (it wouldn\'t be the first-time )but I\'m just not aware of gluten being a component of gelatin capsules. It could be that there is something else that\'s the offending part, perhaps the gelatin itself?, that is unsuitable for IBD sufferers. But, I\'d find that hard to accept as well because most medications for IBD (whether natural or synthetic) are encapsulated in gelatin-based capsules.\r\n

[Boss]

\r\n \r\n True enough. I did google earlier the two words Gelatin and Gluten, and found almost zero matches on the issue, save for ones saying Gluten acts as some kind of Gelatin substitue sometimes or vice versa.
\n
\nI was originally think about this, as something like Fish Oil caps tend to have a clear coating, but some medicines have white, or different coloured ends, but on reflection I summised that\'s some kind of dye of some sort, to better identify different medications or supplements.
\n
\nHay we\'re all wrong sometimes. It\'s okay to be human. Well for the most part, and hay the primates can\'t disagree .\r\n

[Harry Hirsute]

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\r\n \r\n Study: Vitamin C and Blood Pressure
\n
\n 12/18/2008
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\nBERKELEY, Calif.—Plasma vitamin C is inversely associated with blood pressure and change in blood pressure in healthy young adults according to a recent study (Nutr. J 2008;7:35) (DOI:10.1186/1475-2891-7-35). Participants were 242 black and white women aged 18 to 21 years from the Richmond, Calif., cohort of the National Heart, Lung and Blood Institute Growth and Health Study.
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\nIn cross-sectional analysis, plasma ascorbic acid at year 10 was inversely associated with systolic BP and diastolic BP after adjusting for race, body mass index, education and dietary intake of fat and sodium. Persons in the highest one-fourth of the plasma ascorbic acid distribution had 4.66 mmHg lower systolic BP (P=0.005) and 6.04 mmHg lower diastolic BP (P=0.0002) than those in the lowest one-fourth of the distribution.
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\nPlasma ascorbic acid was also inversely associated with change in systolic BP and diastolic BP during the previous year. While diastolic blood pressure among persons in the lowest quartile of plasma ascorbic acid increased by 5.97 mmHg from year nine to year 10, those in the highest quartile of plasma vitamin C increased by only 0.23 mmHg. A similar effect was seen for change in systolic BP (P=0.005).
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\nResearchers concluded, since lower BP in young adulthood may lead to lower BP and decreased incidence of age-associated vascular events in older adults, further investigation of treatment effects of vitamin C on BP regulation in young adults is warranted.\r\n \r\n

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Study: Vitamin C and Blood Pressure\r\n

[Harry Hirsute]

Objective: Hypertension is a common condition with
high mortality from associated diseases. Epidemiological
evidence suggests that a dietary deficiency of vitamin C
may be a risk factor for hypertension. However, it remains
unclear whether vitamin C supplementation could reduce
blood pressure.

Therefore, the purpose of this study was to
provide a comprehensive meta-analysis using randomized,
controlled trials looking at the effect of vitamin C supplementation
on blood pressure in patients with hypertension.

Methods: Nine randomized, controlled trials published
between 1966 and August 2007 with a total of 297 participants
were identified using MEDLINE and a manual
search. Using a random effects model, the effect sizes of
vitamin C supplementation on systolic and diastolic blood
pressure changes were estimated.

Results: Vitamin C supplementation was associated
with a significant reduction in systolic blood pressure with
an effect size of -2.37 mm Hg (95 % CI, -3.14 to -1.6 mm
Hg). However, the mean change in diastolic blood pressure
was non-significant with an effect size of only -0.37 mmHg
(95 % CI, -1.5 to 0.76 mm Hg).

Conclusion: Vitamin C supplementation in hypertensive
patients appears to possess modest effects on reducing
systolic blood pressure.

https://www.ana-jana.org/jana_journal.cfm (issue: JANA Volume 11, No. 1, 2008)